“Works”60+ pages
- p. 5 …Also,
Robert "Gus" Bell contributed with his attractive art work; Richard Wolf provided
invaluable computer expertise…
- p. 14 …Mensuration Working Paper, with Drawing and Photo
xiv
- p. 19 …The ruse worked. However, too much activity
was going on for the project to remain completely…
- p. 28 …The balloon which held
it up, if that is how it worked, must have been about…
- p. 31 …These works included: The Roswell Incident
(1980) by William Moore and Charles Berlitz; "Crashed Saucers: Evidence…
- p. 34 …specialists, including experienced persons who have
continually worked in Army and Air Force records systems since…
- p. 42 …or
classified about their work; they were told only that their work dealt with
meteorological equipment…
- p. 43 …of umbrella cover story to protect our work with MOGUL." Although the Air
Force did not…
- p. 44 …who is married to a staffer who works for Congressman
Schiff. Some of these persons provided…
- p. 48 …Synopsis of Balloon Research Findings by 1st Lt James McAndrew
33. "Mensuration Working Paper," With Drawing…
- p. 51 …to the case, and
that not enough work had been done to report
any results to…
- p. 55 …The work will be performed under GAO code 701034 by staff
from our National Security Analysis…
- p. 56 …Initial work will be performed at the Department of Defense, the
Services, specialized defense agencies, and…
- p. 59 …Secur~ty and Inter.nationa1 Affairs Division (National Security
Analysis) is doinq the work. The review…
- p. 75 …Mary Kathryn Groode, and his friend, John
Kromschroeder.
• A mortician who worked for the funCr.ll…
- p. 76 …Conversations with a dozen people who had worked in the Project Blue Book office
or with…
- p. 106 …This has caused a large back log o£ important work to pile up.
The following is…
- p. 145 …civilian,
Joe Shipman, who works with Col. Hackett is re~orted to have t~ld
the…
- p. 148 …Harness advised he thought we were getting the Merger Bill
worked out pretty fine.
9:35…
- p. 164 …I had two enJisted
agents "working for me" quote end quote.
RW: Who were the enlisted…
- p. 169 …He worked for an insane asylum up in the Washington DC area. I think his
wife…
- p. 170 …He did quite a bit of work for the Air Force, as I found through research…
- p. 183 …we went to all the different records. Working for me I have a group of reservists…
- p. 191 …I need two plug ins to make this
thing work.
SC: You need two?
RW: One…
- p. 196 …the &ranting or clearanc•• to do the work.
Both mthods haw bean succesatul.J¥ u.sod…
- p. 201 …I worked on naval activity such as the thermal affects on
SONAR. Concerning actual baUoon construction…
- p. 205 …Our subsequent work with the balloons and microphones was highly classified and
we didn't know…
- p. 206 …We didn't pattern our work after the Japanese balloons.
We were very secretive of our…
- p. 213 …Charles Ziegler was working on the history of nuclear weapons detection
capability. He had some letters…
- p. 214 …Concerning the name Maj Pritchard, he may have worked for me but I don't recall…
- p. 217 …Project Mogul and some of the other work
that you and Dr. Spilhaus and others have…
- p. 221 …He and I worked together. He was in Maine, and was not really
technically involved. I…
- p. 227 …With some difficulty we got Otto
Winzen who was the entrepreneur cmd promoter, working with Get…
- p. 228 …So you're doing that work from China?
And we
over and
the entire
our
A…
- p. 230 …Schneider and others from NYU,
also Irewin, Minton, Olson, NYU men worked on balloons, north
hangar."
- p. 233 …Before you left active duty, while you were still
working with Duffy and Spilhaus, did they…
- p. 234 …While I was at Georgia Tech I began working with
a microwave, an anonymous propagation research…
- p. 236 …The reason I got into balloons is that while I was working
on this manual there…
- p. 237 …At
that point you were working at New York University under the
direction .•.
A: Spilhaus was…
- p. 240 …He worked for a Tracer lab and is just bringing out a
book on the early…
- p. 242 …Just for the record, ·Major Marcel later worked at
AFOAT-1. Do you recognize him at…
- p. 251 …It often didn't work. That was the reason why for
Operation Sandstone in April and…
- p. 253 …We just worked out of motels in Roswell.
Q: I thought I saw you had a…
- p. 258 …When we sent people to
Roswell, Hackman worked out of a motel to receive.
So the…
- p. 259 …I do know that I worked carefully with a guy named Larry
Dyvad, a pilot, who…
- p. 260 …You were just
saying hey, what's going to work best to get the data, so…
- p. 269 …Tibbetts, the radar lieutenant working for Fletcher, said
that when they got these in '44 there…
- p. 274 …In the course of the research projects you worked on, in that time frame-the postwar…
- p. 275 …You were on-site in New Mexico when Charlie Moore was doing most of his work…
- p. 276 …Did he work for you at Watson Laboratories?
A: No. He didn't work for me…
- p. 279 …Do you recall any of the contractors he may have worked with?
A: No, I don…
- p. 280 …That's where John had his office, and I was there for a time doing work…
- p. 282 …We worked in the old Sun newspaper building in downtown Baltimore.
Q: They had intelligence personnel…
- p. 283 …I know he worked with
the U.S. Geological Survey, a very, very fine organization, and…
- p. 318 …rest on the ranch on which he worked near the town
of Corona, NM. This was…
- p. 322 …In addition, Crary maintlained
a detailed journal of his work throughout his professional career to incluc…
- p. 323 …25 Balloons most suitable for this type of
work were made of polyethylene, a very thin…
- p. 325 …9 appeared to have
been launched on July 3.34 On July 8, their work completed…
- p. 330 …It was apparent from Crary's diary that he had worked very closely with Major
Pritchard…
- p. 379 …MonOay he came to town to sell worked, must have bt!en about 12 some sort…
COL TRAKOWSKI - 6/29/94 2
Maybe the best thing to do before plowing over all this old ground would be to consider some
specific questions you may have. In the course of that, the history may come out.
Q: Were there any documents, or were there any directions either from yourself or from
someone else up the chain to develop a cover story for MOGUL?
A: Not to my knowledge, no. I have never seen such a document nor have I ever heard of
any effort to develop a cover story for MOGUL. The security of MOGUL was a great concern of mine from
the very beginning, because it was like trying to hide an elephant in an open farmyard-almost ludicrous.
Q: Both Dr. Spilhaus and Professor Moore have indicated that they did use weather research
as essentially a cover story when asked questions about what they were doing.
A: Correct. That we did. I'm aware of that. But it was not a policy. It was, if anything, a
lash-up idea on the spur of the moment. And indeed, it was obvious. I may have been involved in using
such a story myself, but to the best of my recollection there was no official stimulation [sic] or
documentation of doing that. If you find such a document I,· indeed, would be surprised.
Q: In the course of the research projects you worked on, in that time frame-the postwar
period-would they give you a cover story on any particular project, even other than this one? Would they
say, this is what you do, say this? Or would they kind of leave it to you, that it was a classified project
and you just didn't discuss it and you just avoided questions?
A: The latter. I have no recollection of a cover story being used on any project that I was
involved in, nor that a prefabricated cover story existed. No. I never encountered any such thing. We
simply treated the security classification straight and did all we could to adhere to it.
Q: So you, as the project officer, you knew that MOGUL was a Top Secret...
A: Did I know that? There was no way to avoid it. I was the project officer, succeeding
Colonel Duffy, and all that history is in the tapes that I made for Ruth Liebowitz. I came into being as
the project officer on Project MOGUL about November of 1946. I had considerable background in nuclear
weapons detection, using devices that I had developed in the Signal Corps. I was an Air Force officer
assigned to the Signal Corps as part of Colonel Duffy's office. Much to the chagrin of the Signal Corps
hierarchy, I was appointed a laboratory chief in the Signal Corps for purposes of developing instrumenta-
tion that the Air Force required, and I did that. In connection with that instrumentation, I conceived of an
application of that instrumentation for use in detection of nuclear weapons. We conducted field
experiments which at best were controversial, and at worst showed no positive result.
So my studies took me into the nuclear weapons problem. I had a background in physics-in
nuclear physics and high-energy physics and modern physics-so I had some understanding of what was
going on. I then took over the development of the original weather radar prototypes that the Air Force
required in 1946. I did that in 1946. From that position, I was transferred to Colonel Duffy's new position
as project officer for Project MOGUL in the Air Force, Watson Laboratories. I took up that task, I believe,
around November. Those dates I think are specific in the tapes I made for Ruth Liebowitz- November
of 1946. Colonel Duffy was reassigned to Wright Field, and I was the project officer. I was Top Secret
control officer in addition to other duties, it being the only Top Secret project at Watson Laboratories at