Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the official transcript of a July 26, 2023 hearing held by the U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Oversight and Accountability's Subcommittee on National Security, the Border, and Foreign Affairs. The hearing was titled "Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena: Implications on National Security, Public Safety, and Government Transparency." Ryan Graves, David Grusch and retired Commander David Fravor testified. Members pressed for transparency and whistleblower protections, and Graves described a near miss involving a dark cube inside a clear sphere.
“Graves”27 pages
46 Mr. GRUSCH. I have concerns based on the interviews I conducted under my official duties of potential violations of the Federal Acqui- sition Regulations—the FAR. Ms. LUNA. Thank you very much. Chairman, I yield the remain- der of my time. Mr. GROTHMAN. OK. We will go to Mr. Raskin for 3 minutes. Mr. RASKIN. Thanks, Mr. Chair, and I thank the witnesses for their endurance and service today. Mr. Fravor, you have described your episode in detail now and you call it the most credible UFO sighting in history. I wonder was this the first time that you encountered a UFO or a UAP in 2004? Commander FRAVOR. Yes. Mr. RASKIN. And what was your general attitude or perspective on the UFO discussion before that happened? Commander FRAVOR. I never felt that we were alone with all the planets out there. But I was not a UFO person. I was not watching History Channel and Mufon and all that. Mr. RASKIN. And have you had experiences or encounters since that happened? Commander FRAVOR. No. Mr. RASKIN. And so, have you formed any general conclusions about what you think you experienced then? Commander FRAVOR. Yes. I think what we experienced was, like I said, well beyond the material science and the capabilities that we had at the time, that we have currently, or that we are going to have in the next 10 to 20 years. Mr. RASKIN. Very good. Mr. Grusch, you have been able to answer in great detail on cer- tain questions and then other things you say you are not able to respond to. Can you just explain where you are drawing the line and what is the basis for that? Mr. GRUSCH. Based on my DODSR security review and what they have determined that is unclassified. Mr. RASKIN. I see. So, you are answering any questions that just call upon your knowledge of unclassified questions but anything that relates to classified matters you are not commenting on in this context? Mr. GRUSCH. In an open session. But happy to participate in a closed session at the right level. Mr. RASKIN. OK. And, Mr. Graves, you said that there are dozens of fellow pilots, military pilots. Are there also commercial pilots who have encountered the same kind of sightings that you de- scribed before? Mr. GRAVES. They are similar. Pilots—commercial pilots have less range and less sensors to be able to reach out and look for ob- jects over wide swaths of airspace. And so pilots are seeing them. Commercial pilots are seeing them and they are typically closer and the range of what they are seeing is pretty large. Mr. RASKIN. What is the most vivid concrete sighting with the naked eye of the objects that you described before, the cube-like ob- jects? Mr. GRAVES. Certainly. I think the most vivid sighting of that would have been a near mid-air that we had at the entrance to our working area. One of these objects was completely stationary at the
Hearing transcript, cited by the archive. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is under it. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.