Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the official transcript of a July 26, 2023 hearing held by the U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Oversight and Accountability's Subcommittee on National Security, the Border, and Foreign Affairs. The hearing was titled "Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena: Implications on National Security, Public Safety, and Government Transparency." Ryan Graves, David Grusch and retired Commander David Fravor testified. Members pressed for transparency and whistleblower protections, and Graves described a near miss involving a dark cube inside a clear sphere.
“Graves”27 pages
37 probably guys with Ph.Ds. that we could probably argue about that. Mr. BURLISON. But you have not seen any documentation that that is what is occurring? It is a theory? Mr. GRUSCH. Only theoretical framework discussion. Mr. BURLISON. OK. OK. Occam’s Razor is that this—these air- crafts have they been identified that they are being produced by domestic, you know, military contractors? Is there any evidence that that is what is being recovered? Mr. GRUSCH. Not to my knowledge. Plus, the recoveries predate a lot of our advanced programs that I previously am waiving off. So—— Mr. BURLISON. So, would it be safe to say that there could be a scenario today where you have an aircraft that crashes because it has been involved in one program from one Federal agency and the—but the agency that retrieves it is not aware of that program and to them it appears alien in origin? Mr. GRUSCH. I mean, that is a hypothetical situation. I am not aware of any historical situation that would match that that you described. Mr. BURLISON. You are not aware—it has not happened that you are aware of? Mr. GRUSCH. That I am aware of. Mr. BURLISON. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Mr. GROTHMAN. Mr. Gaetz? Mr. GAETZ. Several months ago my office received a protected disclosure from Eglin Air Force Base indicating that there was a UAP incident that required my attention. I sought a briefing re- garding that episode and brought with me Congressman Burchett and Congresswoman Luna. We asked to see any of the evidence that had been taken by flight crew in this endeavor and to observe any radar signature as long as—as well as to meet with the flight crew. We were not af- forded access to all of the flight crew and initially we were not af- forded access to images and to radar. Thereafter, we had a bit of a discussion about how authorities flow in the United States of America and we did see the image and we did meet with one member of the flight crew who took the image. The image was of something that I am not able to attach to any human capability either from the United States or from any of our adversaries and I am somewhat informed on the matter having served on the Armed Services Committee for 7 years, having served on the committee that oversees DARPA and advanced technologies for several years. When we spoke with the flight crew and when he showed us the photo that he had taken I asked why the video was not engaged— why we did not have a FLIR system that worked. Here is what he said. They were out on a test mission that day over the Gulf of Mexico and when you are on a test mission you are supposed to have clear airspace. Not supposed to be anything that shows up.
Hearing transcript, cited by the archive. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is under it. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.