Documents / Hearing transcript
This is the printed transcript of a July 26, 2023 hearing before the House Committee on Oversight and Accountability's Subcommittee on National Security, the Border, and Foreign Affairs, chaired by Rep. Glenn Grothman. Ryan Graves, David Grusch and retired Navy Commander David Fravor testified on unidentified anomalous phenomena. Members pressed for transparency, whistleblower protection and better pilot reporting. Graves described a near mid-air collision with a dark cube inside a clear sphere off the Eastern Seaboard.
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45 Mr. GRUSCH. Certainly, closed door and assurances that breaking their NDA they are not going to get administratively punished for so. Mr. BURCHETT. I yield, Mr. Chairman. Mr. GROTHMAN. Thank you. We are going to do something a little bit out of the ordinary here. We are going to give three people a chance at additional 3 minutes. So, Mr. Burchett, do you want to keep going? Mr. BURCHETT. Why don’t you come back to me, Mr. Chairman? Ms. Luna, if she is on—is she on that list? Ms. LUNA. I am on the special list. Mr. GROTHMAN. Sure. Ms. LUNA. Chairman, I would like to submit for the record an ar- ticle by News Nation and it follows Mr. Grusch’s full interview, for the record. Mr. GROTHMAN. Without objection. Ms. LUNA. Thank you. Mr. Grusch, why is it that you refer to the phenomenon as nonhuman intelligence? Why deviate from the basis of extraterrestrial life? Mr. GRUSCH. I think the phenomenon is a very complex and I like to leave an open mind analytically to specific origin. Ms. LUNA. When you say specific origin are you referring—can you elaborate on that for those that might not—— Mr. GRUSCH. If it is a traditional extraterrestrial origin or some- thing else that we do not quite understand from an either biologi- cal or astrophysics perspective. I just like to keep an open mind on what it could be. Ms. LUNA. OK. And referring to your News Nation interview you had referenced specific treaties between governments. Article Three of the nuclear arms treaty with Russia identifies UAPs. It specifically mentions them. To your knowledge, are their safety measures in place with foreign governments or other superpowers to avoid an escalatory situation in the event that a UAP malevolent event occurs? Mr. GRUSCH. You are referring to actual—a public treaty in the U.N. register—it is funny you mentioned that—the agreement on measures to reduce the risk of outbreak of nuclear war signed in 1971. Unclassified treaty publicly available, and if you cite the George Washington University National Security Archives you will find the declassified, in 2013, specific provisions and the specific red line flash message traffic with the specific codes pursuant to Article Three and Article—also situation two, which is in the pre- viously classified NSA archive. What I would recommend—and I tried to get access but I got a wall of silence at the White House—was those specific incidents when those—message traffic was used. I think some scholarship on that would open the door to a further investigation using those publicly available information. Ms. LUNA. Thank you. And then my last question with 51 sec- onds remaining, you mentioned white collar crimes potentially being—taking place in regards to a cover up. Can you please elabo- rate?
Hearing transcript, from the hearings collection. The PDF is mirrored here; the original link is under it. 54 pages are in the text index: search them above, or from the library's search.